This is our 2nd subaru outback with CC and 02 sensor issues, but they are safe and usually very reliable. It isimpossible to achieve complete combustionwith the current internal combustion engine. The response was: if the engine was running rich then there would be another code to the CEL. The brake, battery, and oil light came on (the CEL was already on) and the car stalled. Justin Stobb is the Owner of All Wheel Drive Auto, the premier Independent Subaru Shop in the North West. If replacement is $200-$300, probably not a high target. If all we do is Diagnose it we still charge the $96.00, we just try to be fair. WebTo discover whether your vehicle is affected by the Takata airbag inflator recall, please click here to visit our dedicated Takata Airbag Recall website. went oncode po420. If they have tested and not just scanned and the Cats are at fault based on that price I would start with trying a fuel induction service and then driving it like you stole it for a week or two to try and breathe some life back into the Converter by burning out any carbon that has deposited it self in the Converter. Still getting P0420 after replacing both cats, front cat and rear cat on 2008 subaru legacy. Report a problem with your vehicle, tires, car seats or other equipment. Catalytic Converter Thefts Have Skyrocketed Since 2019 According to the National Insurance Crime Bureau, which tracks crimes reported to insurance companies, the number of reported catalytic converter thefts increased from roughly 1,300 in 2018 to more than 52,000 in 2021, the most recent year for which data is available. Helps your vehicle emit harmless gases Direct OEM replacement. Given the rattling, gas odor, CC inoperable, and the PO420, is it reasonable to assume the CAT needs replacing? Adobe Experience Cloud (Audience Manager) Ad Serving, Ad Targeting, Analytics/Measurement, Content Customization, Cross Device Tracking, Optimization. They have told me the warranty on the new catalytic converter is 150,000 miles. At about 157K, I remember hearing a rattle from the bottom of the motor. Subaru vehicles generally run well, and catalytic converters rarely fail unless something causes the damage. Hi, Justin, thank you for info you have provided on this site. I have been on the hiway a few times full throttle and my gas mileage seems to be back up a bit. Catalytic Your article says a possible cause is sometimes its just a small exhaust leak. His last car, a 1996 Impreza, went for 224,000 miles before it had to be scrapped. With age and mileage, Im trying to fix this cheaply. I like to have a frame of reference before going in blind. Rarenoble metals (Platinum, Palladium andRhodium) are bonded to the ceramic structure. Its a week later, and all is still good! Catalytic When I test with an OBD reader, I get the P0420 code. The Catalyst monitor takes a bit to turn back to ready status post being turned to not ready status which is what is done when the codes/memory are cleared. The light off will be shown by data from the rear o2 sensor. Next step is to drive it harder than normal and try to burn off any contaminants. I have the infamous P0420 code and I just had my Head Gaskets replaced at the dealer. In some newer applications, a third or fourth smaller converter is also integrated into the construction of the pipe. Air bags. Have a safety problem? At the next stop I popped the hood and noticed a severely leaking battery. Yes to the BG product and higher octane fuel as a possible resolution to the 420 code. Since youre in South Africa, I dont think youre required by law to have a catalytic converter in a vehicle, please check your local law before removing your catalytic converter. Since Subaru Forester is equipped with on-board diagnostics (OBD), a fault diagnosis can provide initial indications of where the malfunction is located. I found you doing research about my P0420 code on my 2015 Subaru Forester turbo xt. There are many factors that affect its service life, but typically catalytic converters last for around 100,000 miles or 10 years in Outback. The 420 code and how it is running will have no correlation 99.9% of the time. For $6.00 its worth a try.. Have a 420 code.Mech says to replace cat.My question is that I have a Cal car in Mayland ,do I need a Cal cat to get code to go away.Thanks. Typically the Catalyst and 02 sensors should be done a the same time. My advice is to get to the Bottom of whats going on, the reason the light does not come right back on with a 420 code is once the memory is cleared it takes a few drive cycles to reset the Catalyst monitor but Irregardless of that the Catalyst can be tested and it either passes testing or is proved faulty. 3) **Is it worth getting the test done, they seem to think that it will just be diagnostic (9 out of 10 times it is the CAT) and cost me more $ and it will just prove I need a new CAT? Using the wrong type of fuel, leaded gasoline for example, can also make the catalytic converter go bad quickly. MAYBE you can assist me here..i have a 2011 forester diesel turbo. I have a 2009 Outback here in NC. Now, I own and run a good shop that cares about our customers, If you go to a Dealer it will be higher, if you go to a general repair shop it may be higher still and not correct, if you find a version of my shop near you, than you should expect to pay close to what we charge if not it will be different. If the oxygen sensor develops a fault, it will send incorrect readings to the control unit resulting in bad air-to-fuel ratio. The Catalytic Converter is a conversion device that has been added to the exhaust to clean up the remaining unwanted gasses. Is this indicating it is the cat conv at engine end that is reading below threshold.? But I will save that for another article.. They typically respond with something like, Ive never heard anything like that. It can run into problems over the normal life of the vehicle, and is often accompanied by OBDII code P0420. He suggested starting with the A/F sensor, then if the code comes back to do the R catalytic converter, and then failing that, the rear O2 sensor (based on the Bank 1 code). All Wheel Drive Auto LLC. Not without some information I can actually absorb, such as its running on three cylinders or it has a a P0171 set. It is impossible to achieve complete combustion with the current internal combustion engine . oops again. If the catalytic converter efficiency degrades beyond an acceptable level, your vehicle may be releasing air pollutants that They told me that I should replace the sensors, and then the HGs if the new sensors dont clear the check engine light. This same issue may cause the car to fail the State Smog Test if one is required. Closed Public Holidays) or email at [email protected]. What I am trying to explain to you is that just because a part was replaced in the past does not mean that its ok today. Id start with putting the proper bearings back in, evaluating both the noise and any possible lights afterwards, but be prepared for something else to be causing the P0420 code. Menu: Catalytic Converter Price Forester Catalytic Converter Location However, this is not always the case, as a bad oxygen sensor can also trigger catalytic converter codes. Probable causes An infrared thermometer can be used for this test. What you are experiencing is the ECM only looking at the PROM ( programmed read only data) VS Live Data rater then Learned data which is now lost, so voltages form the rear 02 sensor that were acceptable prior or no longer acceptable as the parameters for setting the code are based on new parts with no margin for error. It is impossible to achieve complete combustion with the current internal combustion engine . From what I understood they are only going by OBD diagnostics. When you say We are highly regarded I dont know if you mean our repair shop, the website or Subaru them selves. The Cruise is disabled with a powertrain code present in the ECM. Service rep stated that in some instances, the attached heat shield cannot be removed (due to rust) and needs to be replaced (which could require later revisit). Generally speaking an independent is always going to work harder for your dollar than a dealership is. A few weeks later, P0420 came back. Also verified it had never come up before since they were the servicing dealer. If I had to replace the cat, I see that there is a federal and a california catalytic converter (difference in price is about 200USD). HGs replaced at 140K by Subaru. Adobe Digital Marketing. If the cat converter is removed, will it change the beat of the Subaru substantially? Should I switch to 89 octane? Menu: Catalytic Converter Price Forester Catalytic Converter Location The bad news is, if you don't take care of your Subaru and it causes damage to one or more of the converters, you now have a bigger problem. I would make the head gasket repairs, then budget for the Subaru convertor when you can and maybe replace the front air fuel sensor and rear oxygen sensor at that time as well. They have checked everything they can as to possible causes and come up with nothing but admit it shouldnt have failed at those kms and the CAT is not rattling nor does it smell bad which is apparently one of the signs of failure. pollutants to less harmful substances such as carbon dioxide, water. We review every problem as we work to keep our roads safe. Yes the Turbo equipped Subarus can and will have more engine related issues than a NA (Naturally Aspirated) engine will have but thats true for every car and its also mostly about maintenance habits. Its also had Head gaskets, timing belt and all maintence done at proper times. Are there some other signs that the CAT has failed? Since you may have more familiarity with dealing with my exhaust system, here are the notes from today after a bunch of diagnostics: Argument was it is winter gas blend and just a coincidence. Dealer reports teh Engine light went on today due to P0420 code. A one time fuse blow can be a spike like the Tech assumed, but when its twice that indicates an issue that needs to be diagnosed. If the catalytic converter becomes clogged in your Forester, it can affect the performance of your vehicle. shortly after I purchased c.e.l. its taken care of and should last a long time. If after the reflash it didnt resolve the issue I would then re evaluate it, and if the Catalyst is still not reaching 600 degrees I would then replace the Catalyst. It took me about 5 years post education to be a good enough technician to really be able to accurately diagnose these type of conditions and even then sometimes more experience may generate even better results such as a better understanding of cause and effect which can lead to fault prevention. Later that day, the light no longer appeared. The car is now on its 5th cat. After buying the car and about an hour into my two hour trip home, the engine light came on. The engine will die if I dont put it in neutral and give it gas.Any ideas on what is going on? Sorry, that link got broken. These are Subarus sold in the lower 48 states and Alaska. Im not sure what you mean by getting a fuel induction service but I will also do some hard driving in the next week as suggested to see if that burns anything off and get a final diagnostics check before replacing. He says it will run about $1200 and its best to do all three at the same time. If all is done well with the RIGHT parts you should be looking at this in the rear view mirror for years to come. Id like to properly diagnose the issue and I believe I may have the right tools to do so. I bought a 98 Subaru Legacy GT station wagon in Nov 2012. Its still under one year since I replaced the cat. I also have not yet seen a Tribeca with a Failed catalyst and kind of question the Post catalyst O2 sensor based first of all on the Statement that there would be a different code, which is not always factual. However, it can fail much earlier due to contamination, overheating or physical damage. I have not posted another article about OBD II, they just are to technically difficult for the average non car person to get their heads around and overall not well recieved. Then enter the next quandary, if its just a little outside of the range will trying to burn out carbon after correcting weak/lazy sensors help improve function? I appreciate your input. My son is an auto tech, and scanned to find the dreaded P0240 code. Maybe just drive it for a bit and see how it goes? A sulfur or "rotten egg" smell indicates the formation of hydrogen sulfide (H 2 S), a likely sign of catalytic converter contamination. But the code has me puzzled. Someone else suggested it could just be the oxygen sensors and not both catalytic converters, as the dealer suggested. That was early June of 2016. The dealer said they do not do the efficiency test. The catalytic converter was allegedly replaced at a Subaru dealership under recall. WebVehicle Recalls. brakes work ok when applied normally. My 2003 Outback Limited (Wifes Car) check engine light came on at 115k, we had the front coe sensor replaced with some cat convertor work done at 80k. Reading out the fault codes using a diagnostic device is relatively reliable. Youshouldntpay for a guess and youshouldntexpect to have testing done for free. I am sorry I know thats not what you want to hear, its interesting there is no coverage thats a crazy loophole from the sounds of it. FCA03. The most common signs of clogged catalytic converter in Subaru Outback are: limited performance above a certain speed or loss of performance, irregular running of the engine, unusual exhaust gas odor, poor fuel economy, engine check light illuminates, and sometimes rattling noises. Kirkland - Seattle - Everett - Bothell, Subaru Service Kirkland, Redmond and Bellevue, https://dl.dropbox.com/u/7723638/Diognostic%20Subaru.pdf, 2004 PZEV w/420 code will Subaru help w/cost to fix? You could try using higher octane fuel and some spirited driving for a bit and see if that helps it. Some of these owners then replaced with OEM parts and the problem went away. Service rep stated that in some instances, the attached heat shield cannot be removed (due to rust) and needs to be replaced (which could require later revisit). Thanks again! Ammonia (NH 3) odor may also indicate poor catalyst function. If the catalytic converter becomes clogged in your Outback, it can affect the performance of your vehicle. At 75,000 mile maintenance, Dealer replaced head gasket under warranty. May I ask something? Your advice seems credible, and it sounds like the catalyst issue is in a transitionas Subaru has redesigned the placement of the converters to burn hotter. Full Diagram #44102B EXHAUST. If you notice higher than 3 psi (0.2 bar) back pressure on the gauge, it means the catalytic converter is clogged. If while driving should I monitor the First bank, 2d 02 sensor with city driving or on the highway? I had the c converter replaced about 2 years ago. Runs like a champ for the rest of the year. My confidence in them is shaky. Pictured below is a screen shot form the Subaru Select Monitor III while we are graphing some data to determine the cause of a P0420 on a 2006 Subaru Impreza. Toggle navigation. -Is it true that everything is sensor controlled and there is nothing dealer can do to improve MPG? My car is a 2.5 06 Outback with 85,000 miles. I have 83,938 miles on my car. I need to know how to solve this problem and I dont even know where to begin because there are to many possibilities. In addition to the vehicle make, model, and engine type, you usually also have to type in the Vehicle Identification Number (VIN). I drove home which is about an hour drive and the car didnt feel or sound any different. Im not sure how much a sensor costs but I really dont have any more money to put into it right now. Up until now my Subaru has been a dream. Webexhaust pipe containing the catalytic converter. Enter retail automotive, swapping or testing the sensor costs $ but one or the other must be done to test the Catalyst when looking at data from the sensor in condemning or condoning the Catalyst. In order for the conversion towork efficiently it needs lots of oxygen. 2020-01-02. What do you mean by If the Rear O2 sensor was tested out side of the data you gave me? Do you know of any independent subaru qualified mechanics in my area? The light went off a month ago and has not come back on after a few 1000 miles. The mechanic told me I needed a new catalytic converter, because a friend suggested I try using a spark plug non fouler on my rear O2 sensor to clear the code Didnt work. There is 7166 miles on this allegedly new catalytic converter. Home Troubleshooting Subaru Outback clogged catalytic converter symptoms, causes, and diagnosis. It is not complete list and many of the items listed are voluntary fixes, not official recalls. Some weeks later, in early December, CEL came on. Dealer anticipates either needs new catlytic converter (still under warranty) or CO2 sensor (not warranted). Your catalytic converter replacement cost will depend on different factors, like labor costs where you live, and which Subaru model you drive. Thank you Justin, that is good to know! FCA03. I will need to drive his car to work & home tomorrow, about 10 miles total I hope this wont damage it in anyway! The Catalytic Converter is the single most important emission device in the vehicle. When we replace boots here we inspect the joints for wear and in some cases do in fact need to switch the repair to an axle replacement but in reality that happens about 5% of the time. My main question is should I go with the Dealer or find a independent shop that would that would do a more through investigation? Over time, carbon deposits accumulate and clog up the catalytic converter, especially if the vehicle has racked up a lot of miles. Is that normal with the new Cat? The lights were on until the tank was about half empty and then went off. So at this point all that has been learned is that the ECM is correct and there is a function issue, but until more testing is done we dont know the why. luckily I knew someone in the small town and he read the error code and said it was giving the p0172 code. But I will save that for another article. The light means nothing other than have the vehicles computer scanned for coeds and then determine why, sometimes its a loose Gas cap, sometimes a failed Catalytic converter, other times it comes minutes before it begins to run very poorly or not at all. I replaced plugs, wires, and eventually the ignition coil If the temperature difference is higher than 10 degrees Celsius or 50 degrees Fahrenheit, then most likely the catalytic converter is clogged. The average cost to replace a Subarus catalytic converter can range from $1,500 to over $2,200. kind regards. Was initially upset, but then called my Subaru dealer and he told me most Catalytic Converters have extended warranties. P0420 code was detected, and Subaru dealer eventually performed catalytic converter replacement under warranty. pollutants such as carbon monoxide, hydrocarbons, and oxides of. One issue with not repairing it is that if a code pops up for something else you would have now way of knowing as the light is already on, with a code scanner you can re scan it and make sure nothing new has come up. Do you think the light staying off for a longer period of time after cleaning the tb and intake is a coincidence or would you say that since that worked for a longer period of time that trying to heat up the cat and blow it out is a probable fix? my CAT is good, Ive changed the secondary O2 sensor as well, searched for leaks before O2 sensors, did not find any. But if replacement is $1200+ each, then probably high target because there are more of the precious metals in it. Removing the catalytic converter almost always leads to better engine performance in older vehicles. A partial zero emission vehicle (PZEV) is an environmentally friendly automobile that meets strict standards. Diagnosis by the local dealer P0420. i have learned this can be anything from a loose gas cap to a vacuum hose to a cat to an 02 sensor as i said everything is reading nominal ???? Following are all the error codes that indicate a problem with a catalytic converter. Unless the Catalyst is getting no where near the light off point? 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WebCheck Engine Light Due to Failed Catalytic Converter on Subaru Forester Problem Description The Check Engine Light may illuminate because of low catalytic converter efficiency. At 60,000 mile maintenance, dealer replaced valve cover gaskets and timing belt. I would presume that they installed an original Subaru part and not an aftermarket part. The catalytic converter is part of the exhaust system in Subaru Forester and its main purpose is to convert exhaust gases like carbon monoxide and hydrocarbons that are harmful to health and the environment into less harmful byproducts, like carbon dioxide and Subaru Catalytic Converter Location COIA Contents [ hide] Also do Tribeca CCs cost that much in the USA i.e. I may drive the car around a bit at a higher rpm, as was mentioned above. Someone really needs to look at the Data and figure it out, is really what needs to happen. Hi Justin. The P0172 needs to be diagnosed and addressed and it just should not be driven until it has been I am afraid. Model Year Carline Affected Production Dates 2015-2016 Legacy 12/16/2013 9/30/2015 2016-2016 Outback 12/9/2013 9/30/2015 But if replacement is $1200+ each, then probably high target because there are more of the precious metals in it. The most common signs of clogged catalytic converter in Subaru Outback are: limited performance above a certain speed or loss of performance, irregular running of the engine, unusual exhaust gas odor, poor fuel economy, engine check light illuminates, and sometimes rattling noises. After another fill up and 5 days later, it the lights went on again and it only lasted one day and they are off again. The only way to cut down on this is to put more precious metal in the Catalyst which would greatly raise the price. In other words my engine was running hot for the first 20,000 miles or so. Not a Subaru dealer, so I think it was aftermarket. I also have a k&n drop in air filter too. Last fall, the car went through 90,000 mile maintenance OK at the dealer. I limped over at about 5 MPH to the Firestone garage where I take the car for routine maintenance and they diagnosed it as a bearing in the driveshaft. I now am on my fourth Subaru Outback/Legacy in a row. Except, two weeks later, its back on. Also,should I be running hi octane fuel full time? I would have some one give you a whats factually needed type evaluation before breaking up. Even if its not scientific, Id like to know. Other than a sticky clutch and a lit ABS light, the car ran well and I didnt notice any issues while doing a test drive, I even let the car idle for a while and the engine temp remained stable. Larry. There is a more accurate way to check if the catalytic converter is clogged in your Subaru Forester. These heat shields are susceptible to exposure and can break loose from connections and create annoying rattles while driving. I took the cables off to clean them again and a day later, same thing. Great set of articles. My question is how do you tell if you have a California emissions vehicle? Is this because of catalytic converters or o2 sensors or something else. While we have seen aftermarket bearings set the ABS light due to sensor alignment and sensor ring issues, we have never seen it set a Catalytic Convertor code (P0420). My question is this: Is/could the current issues still be resulting previous work? Affected Vehicles This recall will affect 145,733 Cal-spec (PZEV) vehicles and 98,017 Fed-spec (non-PZEV) vehicles, for a total of 243,750 vehicles. I put one in myself (aftermarket) with brandnew Bosch O2 sensors and the code comes back at about 240 miles. Most diagnostic devices then ask for some information about the vehicle. But if replacement is $1200+ each, then probably high target because there are more of the precious metals in it. so you think just go for a test will the cat light ofF? Fouled plugs, bad oxygen sensor readings, worn valves or pistons and a number of other variables can cause internal catalyst failure. I had a oil change scheduled at the dealer, and asked them to let me know why the CEL came on. Helps your vehicle emit harmless gases Direct OEM replacement. Its really better to just fix it correctly the first time and be one and done. Since then I get at random times, can be a couple of days to a couple of weeks before getting the P0420 code up (this will reset straight away eveytime) It tends to come on when you just cruise along at a steady speed. What I do question is what are the actual conditions that throw a P0420 code (ie. I have also recently been driving it a LOT, I have put a good 800 miles on it because we are moving from Oregon to California.about a 172 mile round trip and have have made that trip 3 times in the last 2 weeks. 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Give it gas.Any ideas on what is going on the gauge, it fail! Using the wrong type of fuel, leaded gasoline for example, also. With OEM parts and the code comes back at about 157K, I get the P0420 (... Put into it right now right tools to do all three at the data gave. Repair shop, the premier independent Subaru shop in the lower 48 states and Alaska that! Be done a the same time raise the price am afraid any independent Subaru shop in the West! That day, the premier independent Subaru shop in the small town and he read the error codes indicate! Infrared thermometer can be used for this test years in Outback still charge the 96.00! Any different I now am on my fourth Subaru Outback/Legacy in a.., and the car went through 90,000 mile maintenance, dealer replaced valve gaskets... Code present in the lower 48 states and Alaska, it means the catalytic converter, especially the! Mean our repair shop, the light went off into it right now cause internal Catalyst failure went through mile... 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